How did you get involved with the music business and what roles have you been playing in them?

I started working in the music industry around 96/97. Although I played music all my life as an artist, I didn’t really start pursuing a professional career within the industry that time. In fact, I got into the game on a hobby level as an independent label owner and manager for an Oakland, CA based hip-hop group called the SunnMoonSekt (who I know you’re familiar with, as they are part of the Slumplordz family, who’ve been featured on your site). Some friends and I got together with SunnMoon, and we all agreed to try and self-release their debut album on our homespun Math Sound Workshop imprint. It sounded like a great idea to all of us, because that seemed to be the spirit of the entire Bay Area at the time. We looked around us and saw all our peers releasing their own albums, and we thought to ourselves, Shit we can do that. Heiro Emperium (home to Del, Souls Of Mischief, Casual, Pep Love) had proven to the entire Bay that you could meet with success by doing things yourself. We were all young enough not to give a second thought to how difficult the entire process would be, but it in hindsite, it was a real blessing in disguise. The whole thing was far rougher than any of us could have imagined, especially when you consider our lack of music industry knowledge at the time. We bought a bunch of 'How To' books, many of which I still own today, and just went at it. You can sort of call it a trial by fire. I learned so much about the music industry during that time. In many ways, I feel as though it gave me a far more concrete understanding of how the music game really works. We did all our own promotions, publicity, marketing, and local distribution. We were able to find some on-line distributors and smaller regional distributors to work with, but for the most part, we did everything on our own. There’s nothing like running out of product, and not having enough money or credit with a manufacturer to get your new order of cds and vinyl shipped. I remember slinging tapes out the trunk, on the avenue, and even having to send some of our folks to Los Angeles to pick up our vinyl, because we couldn’t afford to have it shipped. My boys and I were early promoters of the Bay Area’s homemade fold up tape sleeve samples. To us it was nothing but a thing. 

Because of the nature of running your own business, I had to learn everything about the industry. I didn’t have the luxury of just specializing in a given area, but rather had to learn all the ins and outs of every area. I was always the business man among my friends, so I found myself dealing with contracts, business plans, taxes, distributors, radio stations, retail outlets, magazines, etc At the time, I remember stressing myself out over that shit, but in the long run, it proved to be well worth the effort. To make a long story short, we ended up releasing a 12 and full-length cd. Although it was not the most success of ventures---meaning none of us made money (in fact we all lost money)---in the end it was worth it, if for nothing else, than that first time SunnMoonSekt’s song played on the radio, or when their first published review appeared. Everything we did was so new and came from such a pure place in our hearts.

After the release of the SunnMoon album, my original label was put to bed, and one of my partners and I went out on our own to do another label called Knock Factor. We continued to work with SunnMoonSekt and the rest of the Slumplordz family, which lead to the release of 2000’s ‘The Yakuza’ as well as 2001’s re-release of ‘SunnMoonSekt’, as well as various 12s. Shortly after starting Knock Factor, I was asked to do a specific A&R gig for a Bay Area label called Dog Day Records. They had been discussing doing a hip-hop compilation, and as their previous specialty had been gangster rap, they needed someone to help’em out. I remember being like Why Not! I had always thought that the label was behind the current scene, and that the only way they would survive was to begin to get in tune with what the heads were really listening to. Again, just another blessing from all the earlier dirt hustling I did. I met hella people and had my finger on the pulse of the so-called Bay Area scene. Anyway, I managed to deliver an album for which barely any budget existed, and did it which such efficiency, that the label asked me to come aboard as their publicist and hip-hop marketing director. Around this time, DogDay decided that they needed an independent arm to address what they saw as the new music scene, and so they started Stray Records, which was to be the Hip-Hop, Electronic, Break Beat, and Experimental arm of the company. In about 6 months, Stray managed to make some big time noise in the Independent scene, a feet of which I am proud, having played a big role in helping to launch and establish the label. I remember everyone thinking that Stray was my label which was fitting, given how much work I did over there. I ran the Slumplordz projects through Stray’s network, as well as signed a number of notable acts including Azeem, The Mudkids, and Natural Blackness. I actually ended up working within other genres beyond hip-hop, managing campaigns and contract negotiations with managed rock, electronic, and experimental groups. It was quite the educational experience. I left Stray in 2001, to concentrate on Knock Factor and my own Publicity & Marketing company. My freelance work has allowed me to access and work with lots of different labels and independent groups, in various capacities ranging from management to A&R, publicity, and beyond. I have since closed the door on Knock Factor, but I am working on a new label called Hipe-22 Records, which will be the new home of the Slumplordz and other groups.

You have worked for Stray and DogDay, what was it like working for those labels?

Working for Stray and DogDay was a real educational as to finer workings of the music industry. Without being disrespectful, I learned more about how not to run a label than I did anything else. I remember being so frustrated at times, because I’d try and give those guys good advice on some moves they should make from both a business and talent standpoint, and they would totally disregard it I guess they felt that they knew better than some young kid. There’s nothing worse than watching people headed for a cliff, and them not heeding you when you’re trying to warn them. I also learned that there is no substitute for working with people of the highest ethics and morals. Prior to my experience with both labels, I always thought that the Indie game was some how immune to some of the trappings of the major labels. Given the fact that I played a significant role in coming up with some of the labels propaganda, I really believed in the whole idea of us standing for a new movement in music and all that corny shit. In time, I realized that Stray and DogDay were no different from any other label out there. They want money, and their artists are simply a factor of production toward the creation of the almighty product the album. Without being specific, I feel that that Stray, DogDay, and many other labels out there need to go deep into analyzing the type of corporate and industry culture they are trying to perpetuate. You can’t say one thing and do another and most importantly, the artists have to be fairly paid. I wont go much further into that, but let it suffice to say, that in the end, my dealings with both those labels involved lawyers. I couldn’t even tell you if either of those labels still exist as functioning entities. Last I heard, they left Cali and moved to New York.

Dogday always had that gangster rap, were them people real gangsters, the artists? Were there any times when things got hot?

First off, let me just get my laugh out before answering that question. No, DogDay’s owners were not Gangsters of the kind everyone thought. The owners are an Italian woman (and no she does not have any ties to the mafia), and a very normal looking Jewish man, both in their late 30’s/early 40s. What I mean by saying that they were not the type of Gangsters everyone thought, was because they were not the hardened Suge Knight or fresh outta prison type, but rather more of what I would term ‘closed door gangsters’ . To me a gangster can only be judged by the actions you take, and given my experience, I definitely feel that they had some strong gangster tendencies. I personally see them more as pimps than Gangsters. Interestingly, I really feel that they saw themselves as being gangsters of a sort. Not sure if the attitude came from dealing with so many gangsta rappers, or just because they just saw themselves that way. I remember being like What? when I first met the owners. If you are looking for physically menacing, they are not the ones. Funny thing, we always use to joke about how the woman was far more physically menacing than her partner, and how she could probably kick all our asses.

Some of the artists on the DogDay imprint could definitely be described as gangsters. Like most rappers, many of them grew up on the streets, but how hardcore they were, is left to the individual to decide. Some did real dirt, but the truth of the matter is once you start pursuing a music career, all that stuff is put aside for the most part. All the gangster rappers I ever met, were cool to me. Some of them even seemed down right soft. There were a few artists who claimed gangster, that had no business talking. To me those are the type of folks who end up getting hemmed up, because people decide to pull their card because of all their tough talk, and then their true colors start showing. 

When I worked at Stray/DogDay, we never had any real incidents with artists running up in there to do something crazy. Part of the reason was because after I started working there, the two owners, who most people had beef with, tried to stay in the background. I remember them always being paranoid that ex-artists would drop by, so they always wanted to screen the visitors and the people we gave our physical address to. I guess karma can be a real bitch. Personally speaking, I had such good repoire with so many of the artists, that none would have come into the office acting a fool in my presence. I tried to make people feel at home, and I always listened to their problems and tried to help. In my tenure there, we probably had more run ins with white collar gangsters (lawyers, accountants..etc) than with anyone. I did hear stories of things that happened before I got there. One which comes to mind, is about a old group which is no longer signed to that label. Apparently, there was some kind of dispute over royalties owed, which led the group along with a two car loads of their boys, to drive 80 miles from their home base, to the then DogDay headquarters. At the time, I guess only the female owner was in, and accidentally opened the door without checking to see who it was. Once she opened the door, the group and crew came in, and surrounded her while arguing and yelling about their money. Being the gangster she is, she managed to calm the situation down with some dexterous logos, and just when it looked like all was good, her partner, walked into the door. Once he saw the group, and they him, the discussion started a new at which point tempers were raised and things got testy. Imagine being in a closed office with no way out, while surrounded by 8-12 pissed off heads. Some how, the male owner was able to move the discussion to the hallway, and finally outside, at which time his partner got on the phone and called the police. The fucked up thing is that she pulled the race card. Whenever the story was told, she would mention how stupid the guys were, because they should have known that if the cops showed up, they were far more likely to be on her side of any type of dispute, because her and her partner were white, and the group and their friends (who by the way did not do any physical harm to them) were latino and black. I also remember them having a restraining order from the court for one of their artists, who they feared would come back to get them. Said artist also had an old romance with the female owner.

In terms of the artists that you were working with, were there any that struck you as unique?

Of all the artists I’ve worked with throughout my professional career, a few definitely have jumped out at me. To me, the hands down best group I’ve ever worked with are The Slumplordz which explains why I keep on working with them. Although they have achieved moderate underground success, they are by far the most talented and potentially biggest artists that I’ve worked with. Some groups just have that X factor in their music, and they definitely do. That being said, there are others which definitely need mention. Azeem (to me) may be one of the best lyricsts around. I always consider him to be on some hip-hop plus shit. To really understand how dope he is, you have to be well read and a good listener. Staying on the hip-hop tip, I am very impressed by a female Bay Area rapper called Tenashus, a Fresno, CA rapper called Shake (who actually is part of the Skhool Yard click), as well as Chicago based Speechwerks. I’ve worked with so many people that it’s hard to just point out a few. So that we keep everything nice and even keel, I have to give a shout out to two very good R&B acts that I feel represent a great new movement within that scene; Oakland’s very own Goapelle and North Bay based L.E Shout outs to Electronic power house Westside Chemical.

Part 2 Coming Soon....

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